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Thread: War!

  1. #33
    Otaku psychical is off to a good start psychical's Avatar
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    Re: War!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lasura View Post
    Nah, I don't say all wars are bad through and through. Everything that must happen, happens. And wars are sometimes the only way to deal the scarce resources we have. And it is said to be one of the ways human population will reduce after reaching the earth's carrying capacity, which is better than long, suffering full starvation. Plus some things that were invented for war can be used in even medicin! (atomic bombs, for example, they use atom spilitting to cure cancer or something) War is one of the things that makes people create new things and develop. And some men just can't live without fights and likewise adventures, and they would most likely become serial killers if there was no army (ok, now I'm going deep into my imagination )
    I would almost say that war is good. But I won't say it is just. Because it still hurts a lot of people.
    I, too, am somewhat suspicious of the United States's reasons for staying in Iraq, whatever they may be. But if we remain merely on the level of suspicion, all we could do is make up stuff from this point on.

    A much better thing to do would be to talk about things we can be sure of... Right?

    So let's talk about your reasons for going to war:

    1) We've run out of resources.

    2) There's just too many people.

    3) Technology advances at a much faster pace if we're at war.

    4) Some men are inherently violent.



    Now let's take a closer look at each one of them.

    1) We've run out of resources...

    Hence, we must go to war...?

    The most likely answer would be: "Because the folks just across the border have more food, drinkable water, natural gas, etc. than we do..." However, simply because they have, and we don't, should never be a justification to waltz across the border, start shooting people, and take what's theirs. That's infantile, and that's selfish. And besides, aren't there more humane, more civil solutions to the problem? Such as, say, asking them nicely to share some with us?

    2) There's just too many people...

    How does war solve the problem of overpopulation?

    By killing them, perhaps? We can't kill other people simply because they, too, need the same basic resources that we do. We weed our gardens on a regular basis because if we don't, there'd be less nutrients for our own plants. We kill parasites such as worms, fleas, lice, and ticks because, well, they feed off us, and they could be carriers of disease.

    Even though some people manage to freeload and hence, become "parasites" in a sense, we can't kill them simply for that. Everyone has a right to live -- that's what we call an intrinsic human right -- and their "being there" in great numbers should never be a reason to slaughter them en masse.

    Let's say you were one of the Slavs in a country under Nazi Germany in World War II. How would you feel if you and your family were slaughtered "to help solve the problem of overpopulation within our borders"?

    3) Technology advances at a much faster pace if we're at war.

    But is war necessary for technological advancement?

    I don't think so. Edison and others came up with brilliant ideas even in the absence of war. I don't see how war played such a key role in the invention of , say, a talking doll or the polymerase chain reaction machine or even the washing machine.

    Granted, war does speed up tech development, but mainly in the field of military tech. And maybe that's all war does... speed up tech development. But it's not necessary. What brings about the invention of things that do benefit humanity is the necessity for such inventions. Man needed more water for his fields; hence, irrigation. Man needed to supply his home with water; hence, plumbing. And so on.

    Necessity, not war, is the mother of invention.

    4) Some men are by nature violent.

    Hence, we need to put them in an army?

    If armies were created merely to satisfy some men's urge to kill other men, then what justifies the existence of armies during peacetime? If we populated our armies with only violent men, and their being violent was the main reason we put them in armies, then what necessarily follows?

    Don't you suppose that they'd run amuck, and start wars on their own, and get our country into trouble? Or worse, wouldn't they even turn on our own civilians instead, just to scratch that bloody itch of theirs?

    That did work for people such as Attila the Hun and Genghis Khan, but then again, these leaders had no decency or morals to them; all they cared about was going around killing people, sacking cities, raping women, and conquering large swathes of land. Their conquests had no goal save those; the existence of the hordes they led was justified by their animal urge to "take what we could, for together, we are strong". (And when these leaders died, the empires they carved out for themselves fell apart soon thereafter.)

    No, I don't think that's a good raison d'etre for an army. And even if we were to concede that it's at least a valid reason, it would be an immoral one... And I'm sure that in the name of all things good, true, and beautiful, you woundn't want such an army to exist... Right?

    So if these reasons won't hold at all, what do you think would be a more noble reason to field armies or wage war?
    Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

  2. #34
    Otaku Fish Hunter 2 Champion, Ice Mania Champion, Pigeon Hunter Champion, Bear & Cat Champion exderz may be famous one day exderz may be famous one day exderz's Avatar
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    Re: War!

    funny thing..looking back at the history..we are at war, because we want peace. or is that just a b.s excuse to take over other country, and their resources... so really if you read the news everyday..we are not having war, because we are violent, is because we want to "keep peace"

  3. #35
    Otaku psychical is off to a good start psychical's Avatar
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    Re: War!

    Quote Originally Posted by exderz View Post
    funny thing..looking back at the history..we are at war, because we want peace. or is that just a b.s excuse to take over other country, and their resources... so really if you read the news everyday..we are not having war, because we are violent, is because we want to "keep peace"
    Ideally, a war fought for peace is a defensive war, and sometimes, it is true that the best defense is offense, even if that means taking over another country. But are people's motives pure? Sometimes, not all the time. And even if a participant's motives may be noble, that doesn't mean that his fellows would follow suit.

    There are just wars. But that's the ideal, and we humans have a history of not living up to ideals. That doesn't mean that ideals don't exist, though. Being just human, we tend to not get the right job done, or the job done right; we could overdo things, or fall short of expectations.

    Of course, what we've been seeing so far in recent history are not exactly thoroughly unjust war, but wars whose motives are suspect; but that doesn't mean that just wars don't exist. It only shows that just wars are vastly outnumbered by unjust ones, or those whose motives aren't pure.
    Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

  4. #36
    Poultry Projectile Cannon Scourge is making a name for themselves Scourge is making a name for themselves Scourge's Avatar
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    Re: War!

    Of cores I don't believe that war is necessary for technological development, gaining resources or any of that. Technology can easily be developed during peace time, and most certainly gaining resources for ones own country can be attained through trade and the world market. As for keeping Human population in check, that’s why I said relatively speaking, another works, not really. So to better my explanation of my last post on my view, in war, some technology advance faster in because of the need for it. Same thing about medicine and antibiotics. We Humans don’t really pick up the pace unless there is a need for it. There was a reason why I left out gaining resources because one doesn’t have to wage a war to gain said resources, because as said by psychical "It’s infantile, selfish, and greedy." Most wars waged by the US are on the intent of a just war, to either defend our self and or our allies from hostile countries or rouge factions such as Alqida. How ever there are those that are in the system will us this for their own personnel gain to siphon off what ever they can for their own greed, but actions of a few selfish individuals should not condemn an action that has its root intent on keeping peace and stability. Sense we got involved in this war, many corrupt offices in our system have been identified and removed and have faced criminal charges. Many believe we are there for the oil when the truth is that we have not taken a drop because the revenue of the oil is going towards Iraq and its reconstruction. Sure we have purchased oil from them, but that is far different then simply taking it. I believe war is necessary when it’s in self defense or keep peace when talks clearly break down and sanctions are not working and the actions of others become questionable or are clearly moving towards hostile intent.
    "MY DEAR... I GIVE YOU THE CAPELLAN CONFEDERATION"
    AND THUS THE WAR WAS STARTED NOT BY GUN SHOT BUT BY WEDDING BELLS

  5. #37
    Newbie tentacle king is off to a good start
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    Re: War!

    War is imminent, because politicians, and humans in general are moronic. I can't stand to share the same genetic code as most so called "humans."

    Sub-human spawns. no better than zerglings. I'll purge them all

  6. #38
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    Re: War!

    Quote Originally Posted by tentacle king View Post
    War is imminent, because politicians, and humans in general are moronic. I can't stand to share the same genetic code as most so called "humans."

    Sub-human spawns. no better than zerglings. I'll purge them all
    Sadly it’s much more complicated then that. All be it that yes waging a war for any other reason other then defending ones self and allies from a hostile threat is moronic. How ever your ending remarks make you sound like a hostile person towards any one who disagrees which in a way makes your intent no better then those who wage war for their own selfish reasons. Your ideology of "I'll purge them all" is similar in aspect of those who we are fighting now because they hate us simply because of who we are or because of what they think we are. I mean no disrespect, all I ask is don’t go flying off the handle bars.
    "MY DEAR... I GIVE YOU THE CAPELLAN CONFEDERATION"
    AND THUS THE WAR WAS STARTED NOT BY GUN SHOT BUT BY WEDDING BELLS

  7. #39
    Newbie tentacle king is off to a good start
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    Re: War!

    anyone who is a threat to the furthering the quality of the human species will be destroyed, and I will do it.

    Also, about complication, surely you're familiar with the mental process of compression. It applies to more than just data. All things are capable of being see simply, no matter how complex.

  8. #40
    Fallen Angel PhoenixSara may be famous one day PhoenixSara's Avatar
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    Re: War!

    Quote Originally Posted by tentacle king View Post
    anyone who is a threat to the furthering the quality of the human species will be destroyed, and I will do it.

    Also, about complication, surely you're familiar with the mental process of compression. It applies to more than just data. All things are capable of being see simply, no matter how complex.
    Do you really think that you can do this! a common mamal itself if complex. Aside from that war is a drastic means of change means last resort.

    Me well they have many forrid stories for one and my gramps say that there were women who forced to become sex slaves or what ever it is you call it , and some of them were not even women some of them really good loooking guys/gays
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