Thread: Choice? Or born with it?

Originally Posted by kenenth84

Yea, I say we are born with it. However, we still have the choice of whether we want to follow it or not. So I say its BOTH ^^
ex: a guy might born with more female character, but if they have taught to be a male and accept it, it's possible that he create a mind block on being gay. To sum up all, there is no choice when one is born with stuff like cancer, but there is a choice on whether one willing to avoid it in the early process or not. ^^
Don't you guys agree?

I do agree that it is both. And I also think that people can influence other people's decisions as well. But, I've known a certain person sense she was a baby and through all that time she has been hard-headed and hard to influence and she has parents that are hard- headed and hard to influence so it makes me believe that she was born with those certain behaviors.

PsiKnot and Akurei Kakudo......you guys are my heroes......

We are all born straight....God designed EVERYONE to be with one person of the OPPOSITE sex.....nuthing else...there is no MIDDLE or inbetween......We as humans chose to start homosexuality and kept it.....Its a choice flat out...No Balance........

Originally Posted by JustLoseIt

PsiKnot and Akurei Kakudo......you guys are my heroes......

We are all born straight....God designed EVERYONE to be with one person of the OPPOSITE sex.....nuthing else...there is no MIDDLE or inbetween......We as humans chose to start homosexuality and kept it.....Its a choice flat out...No Balance........

I used to believe this, until I found out that animals can be homosexual as well.

Besides humans, there are only about 3 other species of animals which are "self aware" and can make "choices" instead of acting purely on instinct. Only these species actually "think things through"

Dogs are not one of these species, dogs cannot think for themselves, all their actions are based on instinct and what they have learned (ie: learning that going past point X in a yard will lead to a shock from the invisible fence)

There are homosexual dogs. And yet no matter how many times scientists run tests, dogs are indeed not self aware, they do not actually know they exist, therefore they cannot carry on the higher thought processes involved in making choices that a few other animals (humans included) can.

This being the case, explain to me how it is a choice? And also, explain if you will, how god has anything to do with the creation of a baby. I feel that the creation of a baby is purly the fusion of male and female gametes, God doesn't get involved. He may have designed the original humans to be with eachother (Adam and Eve [And if you want to get down and dirty Lilith who was supposedly cast aside]) However since then our bodies have remained pretty much the same, but the mind has not.

Originally Posted by frr_vegeta

I used to believe this, until I found out that animals can be homosexual as well.

Besides humans, there are only about 3 other species of animals which are "self aware" and can make "choices" instead of acting purely on instinct. Only these species actually "think things through"

Dogs are not one of these species, dogs cannot think for themselves, all their actions are based on instinct and what they have learned (ie: learning that going past point X in a yard will lead to a shock from the invisible fence)

There are homosexual dogs. And yet no matter how many times scientists run tests, dogs are indeed not self aware, they do not actually know they exist, therefore they cannot carry on the higher thought processes involved in making choices that a few other animals (humans included) can.

This being the case, explain to me how it is a choice? And also, explain if you will, how god has anything to do with the creation of a baby. I feel that the creation of a baby is purly the fusion of male and female gametes, God doesn't get involved.

ew..plz don't remind me of homosexual animals*shudders* eep nasty..my cats were lesbians, and the gross part ws they're half sisters

Originally Posted by Mistress Isis

ew..plz don't remind me of homosexual animals*shudders* eep nasty..my cats were lesbians, and the gross part ws they're half sisters

With most species of animals incest is no different from anything else.

Did you know that every single golden hamster in existance today is from a single small family of them found in the early 1900's?


Now THAT'S incest.

Originally Posted by frr_vegeta

With most species of animals incest is no different from anything else.

Did you know that every single golden hamster in existance today is from a single small family of them found in the early 1900's?


Now THAT'S incest.

eep, nasty lol

Originally Posted by Mistress Isis

ew..plz don't remind me of homosexual animals*shudders* eep nasty..my cats were lesbians, and the gross part ws they're half sisters

... Get over it...

Anyway, as for homosexuality and "being born with it"...

From sociologist Steven Goldberg, Ph.D.:

"Virtually all of the evidence argues against there being a determinative physiological causal factor and I know of no researcher who believes that such a determinative factor exists...such factors play a predisposing, not a determinative role...I know of no one in the field who argues that homosexuality can be explained without reference to environmental factors."

and...

When "gay gene" researcher Dr. Dean Hamer was asked if homosexuality was rooted solely in biology, he replied:

"Absolutely not. From twin studies, we already know that half or more of the variability in sexual orientation is not inherited. Our studies try to pinpoint the genetic factors...not negate the psychosocial factors."

More at http://www.narth.com/docs/bornway.html