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Thread: The 5 Commandments?

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    Lady Barronmore Arrianna has become well known Arrianna has become well known Arrianna has become well known Arrianna's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 Commandments?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hassun View Post
    I highly doubt there were radical environmentalists back in those days. So it's at most just a way some people choose to interpret it today. That said it's only logical for us to take care of the planet and its contents. We depend on it to survive after all. We're going to have to hold out at least long enough for us to develop space colonization.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hassun View Post
    4. see rule 2. I think I noticed you pointing some arrows at environmental groups before. This is where they come in.
    Actually I pointed arrows at both extremes. One law condemns the one side and the other condemns the opposite. Taken together they become "everything in the earth is here for our use so take good care of it and use it wisely because you will be held accountable for what you actually do with it." You may not see the difference but the understanding of being a good steward is something that seems to be missed these days by those who wish to hide their "talent", prevent the use altogether, rather then use it and those who don't give a care what happens as long as they make money alike. You live in the UK, what does maintaining the wilderness mean there?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hassun View Post
    Judging whether or not certain individuals pose a threat to humanity can be very difficult and places a lot of power in the shoes of the people deciding this.
    It also means trusting people. Not so easy for some of us is it? It is said we see in others what we are ourselves. So I find it interesting which people seem to feel that people cannot be trusted with any major decision and which people are willing to believe in others.

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    Re: The 5 Commandments?

    It seems a couple of posts were made while I was still editing my reply, sorry for the confusion.

    Solving a problem like wildlife preservation is another matter altogether. And people who work on it will testify just how difficult that is.

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    Grouchy Old Anime Otaku LenMiyata has become well known LenMiyata has become well known LenMiyata has become well known LenMiyata's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 Commandments?

    Grumble Grumble Grumble
    Quote Originally Posted by Arrianna View Post
    In Biblical terms murder is a legal term with a very specific meaning. A simplified definition is "unlawful killing", modern US law calls it 1st Degree Murder. Defense, execution, and warfare are not included.
    So basically, the state is incapable of committing murder, since all actions done in the name of the state, with the power of the state, are by definition 'Lawful'
    Quote Originally Posted by Scourge View Post
    See, now your twisting things around here Len and making them more complicated then it needs to be. Its really straight forward. The reason why exicusion is aloud and is forgivable to ending the life of a murderer is that the murderer has proven that they can not live in peace with the rest of society, and the fact is we can simply look at police reports of criminals who have been charged with murder who get reliced and end up back to killing people again.
    It's not as twisted (or as straight forward,) as you think. The original 5 Commandments and early Biblical tradition appears to have no support for the concept of 'unalienable rights' provided by God, above and beyond the power of law, as proposed in the US Declaration of Independence. It also wouldn't support the more modern concept of holding military and political leaders accountable for 'crimes against humanity', where it is now possible for a state, (and it's leaders) to commit murder on a massive scale...
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    Re: The 5 Commandments?

    Matthew 22:36-40
    "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments."

    These are the commandments i try to live by, the first being quoted from the Old Testament, and the second being from the New. Jesus came to rewrite the Old Testament, so to speak, since He became the bridge between God and man. The commandments given to Moses were meant to help him start a literal new world, and a literal new way of life. Jesus came to start a new spiritual world, a new spiritual way of life. Which i find more applicable, but again, just an opinion.

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    Re: The 5 Commandments?

    Yes Christ said that those were the two most important commandments (and they pretty much encapsulate everything else) but...

    He was teaching a personal law not government laws which is what the Noahide and Mosaic Laws were, they are two different sets of standards due to the different responsibilities involved. Remember the phrase "the Law and the Prophets", the Noahide and Mosaic were the laws and Christ himself reinforced the teachings of the Prophets. Read the beatitudes and you can see more of his teachings and commandments. Maybe that is why so many people concentrate on the ten commandments or "law", they don't want to deal with the strictness of the commandments given by Christ himself.


    Quote Originally Posted by LenMiyata View Post
    Grumble Grumble Grumble

    So basically, the state is incapable of committing murder, since all actions done in the name of the state, with the power of the state, are by definition 'Lawful'
    I did say it was simplified, sometimes it can be oversimplified, that is why I also provided a link to the definition of 1st degree murder. The laws had definitions of what was and was not lawful killing. Defense, and warfare are not included in that and neither is execution. What was included was the equivalent of our:
    In most states, first-degree murder is defined as an unlawful killing that is both willful and premeditated, meaning that it was committed after planning or "lying in wait" for the victim.

    Most states also adhere to a legal concept known as the "felony murder rule," under which a person commits first-degree murder if any death (even an accidental one) results from the commission of certain violent felonies
    They also had the addition of robbing someone being considered murder. Robbery in this case meant to steal from them in the wilderness (stealing in a city was theft) because if you took everything someone had in the wilderness at that time you had just condemned them to die.



    As for the equivalent of "unalienable rights" those are found in the Noahide Laws that were cited earlier as one of the six that came from the time of Adam.
    Quote Originally Posted by Artistic Anarchy View Post
    6 - Set up righteous and honest courts, and apply fair justice in judging offenders, and uphold the principles of the last five (Dinim).
    There is also scriptural references to the standards that governments will be judged on and they are three things:
    1. Protecting the people's right to worship.
    2. Protecting the people's safety.
    3. Protecting the people's right to own property.
    Yes, number one is worship but these are the judgments of God we are speaking of. I would say based on those that a lot of our governments are in trouble aren't they?

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    Re: The 5 Commandments?

    Quote Originally Posted by Arrianna View Post
    I would say based on those that a lot of our governments are in trouble aren't they?
    To be quite frank, they already are, at least the ones that are in The United States and France.

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    Re: The 5 Commandments?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scourge View Post
    See, now your twisting things around here Len and making them more complicated then it needs to be. Its really straight forward. The reason why exicusion is aloud and is forgivable to ending the life of a murderer is that the murderer has proven that they can not live in peace with the rest of society, and the fact is we can simply look at police reports of criminals who have been charged with murder who get reliced and end up back to killing people again.
    God doesn't justify people killing eachother regardless of who the person is.The bible says that only god decides weather someone is bad or weather they should live or die NO one else.God also doesn't approve of government or law because its one person or persons countrolling and judging others.

    No one has the right to kill those criminals because their human beings

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    Re: The 5 Commandments?

    Quote Originally Posted by syrayian View Post
    God doesn't justify people killing eachother regardless of who the person is.The bible says that only god decides weather someone is bad or weather they should live or die NO one else.God also doesn't approve of government or law because its one person or persons countrolling and judging others.

    No one has the right to kill those criminals because their human beings
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