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Thread: Creation

  1. #41
    God Of Angelz Submarine Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Pencak Champion, Grand Prix Challenge 2 Champion, Twelve Swap Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Crab Volleyball Champion, Hockey Shooter Champion, Trick Master Funky Champion, Mah-Jong Connect Champion, W.R.A.X. Champion dark1angel may be famous one day dark1angel's Avatar
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    Exclamation Re: Creation

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy Spring View Post
    I have a teacher who is a very open minded person and a lot of times he will talk about things that a lot of people are either afraid to talk about or he can give you a whole new perspecive on said topic. Today in class, he started talking about the creation of the world and people. He gave us three choices to think about. The biblical point, evolution, or for him, a mix of the two. What do you think about creation and why do you feel that what you believe has a firm standing point?
    Hmm this is really an interesting question, although i never heard of it in a perspective point. Well the firm standin point, well ahh gee *lets see here, pulls out references* ahh okay here we go, the point of creation has been a wonder full of life. Is this the question your asking of how the worl got created or what kind of question is this, since all of a sudden i am confused and lost now. Do please remind me the question before the firm standing point.

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  2. #42
    Ecchi Enthusiast Classic Donkey Kong Champion, Balloon Bomber Champion, Fishing Impossible Champion, Festival Of History : Archery Champion, Dare Devil Champion, Little Monkey Does Champion, Dragon Champion, Barty Champion, Cheesy Champion, Chicken Attack Champion, Moo Lander Champion, Hang Stan Champion, Hangaroo Champion, Sentenced Champion, Canadair Champion Miroku4444 may be famous one day Miroku4444 may be famous one day Miroku4444's Avatar
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    Re: Creation

    Also Scientists are and have been historically “wrong” on darn near everything, why? Because it is all guess work and theories, Science is about the possibilities and if they hold any merit or plausibility, not if they are "true and fact". Science cannot prove anything and it doesn't try. They just theorize, test and draw conclusions. The progression is that with more tests hopefully the conclusions will be come more reliable in the sense we can use them to progress mankind.
    Come on dont tell me they didnt prove anything. Didnt scientist finally prove the earth is round, that we have a total of 46 chromosomes that come in 23 pairs or homologous, there are other galaxy's besides our own, and other stuff like this? They may get it wrong on some stuff, but not "darn near everything". Its not because of "Because it is all guess work and theories", it from lack of technology or total understanding to prove these theory's and such.

    I never said carbon dating was totally accurate, I said it was accurate enough to prove the earths way older than 6000 years. Even so there are other ways to prove its older than that also.

    The progression is that with more tests hopefully the conclusions will be come more reliable in the sense we can use them to progress mankind.
    ....and that hopefully they will find evidence to prove their theory's which do happen sometimes. Dont tell me your believe that no scientist has never found evidence to prove his theorys. Flight, the atom bomb, being able to land on the moon, the world is round, cars were all just theory's and guess work at one time.

    You assume too much about what I believe, when did I ever say that the earth was 6000 years old? The Bible does not give a “date” or “age” of the earth nor does it give us a “true” means to know how old it is. The monk who came up with 6,000 years was trying to trace back to the exact year with an incomplete biblical genealogy. How can you come back to something when parts of your “numbers” are missing or unclear? Thus the 6,000 years is junk. How old is the earth? NO ONE KNOWS and to me, it doesn’t matter.
    I think if you talk to religious scholars the new # is like 10,000 years which is still junk.
    Last edited by Miroku4444; Mar 24, 2008 at 03:59 PM.

  3. #43
    Mage of Eternity Joe Mage is making a name for themselves Joe Mage is making a name for themselves Joe Mage's Avatar
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    Re: Creation

    Quote Originally Posted by tsurara View Post
    The outpouring of hate-mail I recieved overnight is truly touching, and telling of some members' devotion to "Christ-like" thinking.

    To Answer It All Here:

    1) For some reason, some gays are masochistic enough to be Christian:
    CHRISTIANGAYS.COM: Gay & Lesbian Christian Fellowship
    2) I am female
    3) I was called an idiot, I can't recall having called anyone else one
    4) I did not ban the user in question, I issued one 35 point infraction for "insulting a member" (for calling me an idiot without provocation)
    5) Muslims and Jews believe in the very same account of creation as Christians... I see no reason to qualify which religion I'm speaking about when saying that the story doesn't strike me as likely or literally true. The laws of Leviticus, the only other portion of the Bible I referenced by name are also applied in Islam and Judaism (though in Islam they are attributed to someone else). I never said that I was speaking to or of Christians -- I was discussing the topic at hand: Biblical Creation.
    6) After being told that I was an idiot for bringing up Biblical Law because the Covenant with Christ has erased it completely, I was then sent an e-mail informing me that homosexuality is a sin and that I will go to hell for it. I find this to be an ironic confirmation that Christians do, indeed, often "pick and choose" which portions of the Bible to apply to themselves and to others as they find them convenient.

    In closing, a quote from Ghandi... a man the literal Bible would also put in hell:

    " I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ. "
    I applaud u, Tsurara, for not stoopin' ta the level of the one that called u an "idiot." The fact that u showed great restraint in that matter is truly admirable. And some Christians have a tendency ta forget that the Bible says; "Judge not lest ye be judged yourself," "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone," and that there isn' a single person alive who is without "sin" and that we're born inta the world wit it. No one, and I mean absolutely No one, on this earth has a right ta judge who is and who isn' goin' ta hell, that in of itself is also a sin. I feel that this type of behavior is somethin' that Christ would not approve of. I feel that it is truly shameful that there r some ppl who would resort ta such behavior. I am very appalled at such immature and judgemental behavior. I apologize for my rant.

    Sanity doesn't exist, it's just an excuse cooked up by crazy people to justify their actions. My myspace page: www.myspace.com/joemage

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  5. #44
    Otaku Cruisin with crush Champion, Animal Rescue Champion abby724 is off to a good start abby724's Avatar
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    Re: Creation

    What do you think about creation and why do you feel that what you believe has a firm standing point
    I have to go with the whole "Big Bang" theory and evolution. Why? Because the people supporting and/or researching into these theories come from a line of work that's made many discoveries both proven, and very, very beneficial to the progress of mankind. Yes, they're still flawed humans, but they've sent people to the moon, discovered genetics, and done much more... I'm assuming that one would have to be very knowledgable to accomplish such feats... So yes, my confidence in those two theories stems from their credibility.

    Yes, we haven't found rock-hard evidence to prove the Big Bang straight out. Maybe the universe was created some other way. But I like and trust science, okay? "No science, no cancer cures!" is something I like to say impulsively.

    Why don't I trust creation from any religious standpoints? Religious beliefs are just too fuzzy. Hah! There's the key word: belief. It's all faith, or at least, nothing is rock-hard enough for me to turn me over... Specifically, that the Bible is truth... Where's the proof that the Bible is God's word, even? Not just written by a group of charismatic people with mental disorders? And we've had more than our fair share of charismatic people with questionable mental stability levels...
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  6. #45
    Commander Ham Chiefblackhammer is making a name for themselves Chiefblackhammer is making a name for themselves Chiefblackhammer is making a name for themselves Chiefblackhammer's Avatar
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    Re: Creation

    Quote Originally Posted by Miroku4444 View Post
    Come on dont tell me they didnt prove anything. Didnt scientist finally prove the earth is round, that we have a total of 46 chromosomes that come in 23 pairs or homologous, there are other galaxy's besides our own, and other stuff like this? They may get it wrong on some stuff, but not "darn near everything". Its not because of "Because it is all guess work and theories", it from lack of technology or total understanding to prove these theory's and such.

    ....and that hopefully they will find evidence to prove their theory's which do happen sometimes. Dont tell me your believe that no scientist has never found evidence to prove his theorys. Flight, the atom bomb, being able to land on the moon, the world is round, cars were all just theory's and guess work at one time.
    Earth isn't round, in fact it happens to be very "flat" in places as theorized by modern day scientists to the point to say that the poles are indeed .33% flatter than at the equator...so no they didn't prove the earth was round...in fact they haven't "proved" any aspect of it...have they measured the earth...really? Made a big cast of it and seen if the earth was truly round? No they haven't. But yes I believe it is round however I claim no "proof" of it.

    46 chromosomes? You mean 46 "known" chromosomes... have they studied the chromosomes of all humans? No, are most of the things they know about chromosomes estimates? Yes (like gene basis and length). In fact there is huge debate over if we have 46, 47 or 48 of them..the 46 is just the generally accepted number...for now.

    Other galaxies? Really has anyone been to one of them? How do we know that they are really there? Pictures of them using a big telescope? Maybe NASA photoshoped it all Don't get me wrong I DO believe in them but that doesn't mean it is "proven" is all I am saying.

    Why? Because in order to "prove" something you have to test in in every possible way and scenario, under all circumstances and science can't and never will be able to do that. For 1 thing, 1 simple theory there are infinite tests and no amount of time could exhaust them. Thus you can't prove anything, you can only test and draw logical conclusions about those tests.

    Can those test produce convincing results sure and in fact they can produce usable advancements in technology and products (which shouldn't be confused with the theory...cars aren't scientific theory ...they are results of tests which sought to determine some aspect of science)

    Now don't get me wrong, I am not saying science cannot ascertain truths, such as under this set of criteria you will obtain this result (hence the splitting of atoms and the atomic bomb) but that it can't take that result and say it proves theory. Only that the evidence "suggests" this to be true and that the results of our tests can be reproduced indefinitely with the same result.

    Which is very different from saying it "proves" anything, no scientist will claim any test proves a theory.

    It is just that, the evidence which is blatantly suggestive to a singular result which I can say are the things I believe about science, not the theories in whole or even as they are written.

    Quote Originally Posted by Miroku4444 View Post
    I never said carbon dating was totally accurate, I said it was accurate enough to prove the earths way older than 6000 years. Even so there are other ways to prove its older than that also.

    I think if you talk to religious scholars the new # is like 10,000 years which is still junk.
    Again I never said the earth was 6,000 years old or even 10,000 years old, neither of which are believable or proven true under Biblical analysis. The Bible offers nothing to suggest that those numbers are anything more than an estimate, which I happen to call...bull.

    However when a scientist uses a flawed measurement of the "age" to tell me the age aspects of the universe and tries to tell me that this is how and when things happened. I call it the same thing, bull.


  7. #46
    anti-semantics Pub Quiz Champion tsurara may be famous one day tsurara may be famous one day tsurara's Avatar
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    Re: Creation

    Quote Originally Posted by Chiefblackhammer View Post
    Made a big cast of it and seen if the earth was truly round? No they haven't. But yes I believe it is round however I claim no "proof" of it.
    Semantics... and even then it doesn't work since "round" doesn't imply a perfect sphere anyway (round - Definitions from Dictionary.com). A soccer ball isn't a perfect sphere either... it's not "round"? An egg's not round? An sheet of paper cut by a six-year old in the shape of a circle isn't round? It's still round (and we know that you can't "sail off the edge of it" like everyone used to think... and execute people for not believing). The only "proof" that should be required is the experience of having flown from the United States to Japan and then back in the other direction. I did it... and I didn't fall off.

    I assure you, the earth is globular.

  8. #47
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    Re: Creation

    Quote Originally Posted by Miroku4444 View Post
    I never said carbon dating was totally accurate, I said it was accurate enough to prove the earths way older than 6000 years. Even so there are other ways to prove its older than that also.
    no i dont agree because Potassium-argon dating is a geochronological method used commonly to date geological events, particularly the eruption and cooling of igneous rocks and like carbon dating it is widely used by scientist.

    But heres the catch Researchers found in Hawaii. A lava flow that is known to have taken place in 1800-1801 — less than 200 years ago — was dated by potassium-argon dating as being 2,960 million years old.

    So i at least think plausible to say that carbon dating could be wrong and place a earth thats 10,000 or so years old to 4.54 billion or so years old and honestly i not sure how old the earth is but i do believe in the bible and i think it closer to 10,000 than 4.54 billion.

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  10. #48
    Commander Ham Chiefblackhammer is making a name for themselves Chiefblackhammer is making a name for themselves Chiefblackhammer is making a name for themselves Chiefblackhammer's Avatar
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    Re: Creation

    Quote Originally Posted by tsurara View Post
    Semantics... and even then it doesn't work since "round" doesn't imply a perfect sphere anyway (round - Definitions from Dictionary.com). A soccer ball isn't a perfect sphere either... it's not "round"? An egg's not round? An sheet of paper cut by a six-year old in the shape of a circle isn't round? It's still round (and we know that you can't "sail off the edge of it" like everyone used to think... and execute people for not believing). The only "proof" that should be required is the experience of having flown from the United States to Japan and then back in the other direction. I did it... and I didn't fall off.

    I assure you, the earth is globular.
    Of course it is all semantics, but when someone says science can "prove" something they open themselves up to the "semantics" of that. Every discussion or debate has some aspect of it which covers the semantics involved. It would be no different than if I claimed a biblical reference as "proven." Someone would come by and call me on it because in fact I can't "prove it."

    Also you didn't fall off the earth because gravity is constantly pulling towards the center of the earth at near equal proportions all over (at least that is what is said to be)... so it is that same gravity which would keep you from falling off even if the world was truly flat (supposedly).

    Likewise it is gravity (supposedly) which gives the earth a spherical shape due to the near equal pull, I don't deny that at all, I am just saying is you can't say that it is "proven."


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