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Thread: Franklin Roosevelt and Pearl Harbor Conspiracy

  1. #17
    Otaku Chubz may be famous one day Chubz may be famous one day Chubz's Avatar
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    Re: Franklin Roosevelt and Pearl Harbor Conspiracy

    That also happened just a bit after 9/11 as well, but it was just a pilot who had gone off course, but they evacuated the White House. My hypothetical situation would be assuming that whatever event was about to happen was absolutely dire (and it was immenent and impossible to avoid), and mass damage was going to be caused, including a high amount of loss of life.

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    Re: Franklin Roosevelt and Pearl Harbor Conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Chubz View Post
    That also happened just a bit after 9/11 as well, but it was just a pilot who had gone off course, but they evacuated the White House. My hypothetical situation would be assuming that whatever event was about to happen was absolutely dire (and it was immenent and impossible to avoid), and mass damage was going to be caused, including a high amount of loss of life.
    No Chubs, it did not happen after 9/11. It happened in the Clinton Administration. The plane was detected, hit the white house lawn and slid into the building. The pilot died and it was assumed that it was an assassination attempt. While the government reserves the right to 'take action' no action was taken.

    Here's an article on the subject.

    Radar Detected Airplane before White House Crash

    I'm telling you, strait up, in the pre 9/11 world it would be political suicide for a president to order the military to shoot a civilian plain out of the sky. People would have been up in arms over it. Even in a post 9/11 world it would be a very risky manuvore for a president to order military fighters to shoot down a passenger plane. The investigation would have to PROVE without any doubt that he was in mortal danger for their not to be an outcry over it.

    And that's the thing, people are trying to apply post 9/11 thinking to a pre 9/11 situation. That's all im saying. Why didn't Bust do this or that? Because on the morning of 9/11 such thoughts either had never been thought before or the political landscape would not allow such an action to take place without dire consequences.

    Hindsight may be 20/20 but that doesn't mean you can just pick and choose when and where your going to apply it.

  3. #19
    Otaku Chubz may be famous one day Chubz may be famous one day Chubz's Avatar
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    Re: Franklin Roosevelt and Pearl Harbor Conspiracy

    The event I listed in the last post was a different one (which is why I said 'also). It happened awhile after 9/11, where a civilian plane was off course and was flying within Washington D.C towards the White House, so they evacuated it. I wasn't debating your event, I was mentioning a similiar one that happened after 9/11. However, here's something from the Washington Journal that talks about the possible shooting down of a civilian aircraft, post 9/11:

    Civilian Plane

    And this link is about the event I was talking about (civilian off course, triggering white house evacuation):

    Civilian Airplane, off course

    I'm not trying to argue anything about what Bush did or didn't do, or what happened on 9/11. I was using the event as an example (as in, if something like that were to happen again). I'm not debating what ACTUALLY happened on 9/11.

    When reading this part, keep 9/11 out of mind, just so we don't get confused. What I was saying in my original post was that Roosevelt would not have allowed the Pearl Harbour attack to happen, and I also cited an example where people thought that Churchill had known about the mass bombing of Coventry (both of which are false). BUT, I do believe in a dire situation (and I mean dire) a government would allow the death of civilians if it meant that it would save more. (And I don't mean like a hostage situation, where they'd say "okay, shoot five people, let 10 go").

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    Otaku Barronmore may be famous one day Barronmore may be famous one day Barronmore's Avatar
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    Re: Franklin Roosevelt and Pearl Harbor Conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Chubz View Post
    The event I listed in the last post was a different one (which is why I said 'also). It happened awhile after 9/11, where a civilian
    Sorry. I guess I'm just really touchy this week. I didn't see also (or didn't register it) and kinda got upset. Again, I apologize.

    I'm getting really tired of all these conspiracy theories. I wouldn't mind them if they actually made SOME sense but when they just kinda exist despite any logic that completely shows it to be without merit I get really tired of seeing them all the time.

    Honestly today, I would fully support military defense against a civilian aircraft if it was proof positive that it was being used as a weapon and the passengers on board were deffinatley going to die. But I still think any president who did it would be very worried about the ramifications of doing it.

    I think i'm gonna take a few weeks (minimum) off from the site. I'm burned out and losing my temper to easily.

  5. #21
    Otaku Chubz may be famous one day Chubz may be famous one day Chubz's Avatar
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    Re: Franklin Roosevelt and Pearl Harbor Conspiracy

    That's no problem, your post didn't seem touchy or anything.

    You're right that shooting down a civilian aircraft would be a SUPER touchy thing, and a tough call for a president to make. Even if it was a dire situation, and the government did have to shoot down a civilian plane to save more, you'd probably still have a couple people who would complain about militaristic tendencies and whatnot, and blame the government either way. It would be a 'damned if you do, damned if you don't' situation for the president.

    For awhile I did believe the Winston Churchill conspiracy theory (at the time I thought it was fact, not a theory). But that's because my family is from Britain, so when I was growing up this was what was told to me, and the history books I had read didn't mention that this wasn't true. It wasn't until awhile ago that they actually dispelled the theory (if you're interested, here's a link to an article about it. Coventry Bombing myth).

    But yeah, conspiracy theories just bend any type of logic to the extreme. One of the universities I've been too had a movie night where they played a whole bunch of conspiracy movies about 9/11, and I decided to show up. While there were a couple of movies that weren't radical conspiracy stuff (a few where just about the inner workings of government), most of them were just these fabricated theories that couldn't possibly have happened.

    I completely agree with you about supporting military defence if it was proof positive that it was being used as a weapon, and there was no other alternative to bringing the plane down. While it is a horrible thought of having to fire on civilians, unfortunately if it would save more people then the tough call would have to be made.

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