tsurara

Something tells me that anyone with a real hand for Science wouldn't believe in God in the first place...

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atomik_sprout

Exactly. Comparing religion/spirituality and science is like comparing apples and oranges. They're not the same. Yes, most things can be explained by science... But not all things. You can say that the signs that we receive from God are just psychological manifestations or whatever, but the truth of the matter is that there are some things that simply cannot be explained except by saying that God intervened or did something to tell people what they need to do to make this world a better place.

Science can't explain my car accident. It can give a step-by-step breakdown of how it happened. It can possibly predict the accident before it happens. But it cannot explain why we did not catch on fire with the car. Why, when nobody was buckled up, we exited the vehicle unscathed. Science can't explain why we didn't blow up with the power generator, nor can it explain how a skinny pine tree broke our fall and prevented us from being crushed between the earth and our car.

Science cannot explain how a song by P.O.D. (a rock band) started playing on a HIP-HOP STATION in the middle of our "flaming barrel roll". Science cannot explain how women, who weren't able to bear children for nearly a decade, miraculously give birth to new life. You catch my drift? ^_^
God speaks to people every day, even when you don't think he is... He is.

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aceman67

The way I see it, God created everything, including science.

I have all of POD's cd's, and they are a Rock/Hip-Hop band, in fact, some of their songs are reggae in nature

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tsurara

Many people of faith still believe in Science... but I'm afraid it doesn't often work in reverse. Most Scientists become scientists because they have a driving curiosity about WHY things are the way they are. They don't accept "Just because" or "God" as answers to life's mysteries.

Scientists would have discovered very little through the years had they accepted the popular conclusion: "God".

Just because something hasn't been explained Scientifically YET doesn't necesarily mean it can't be someday.

In many ways, Science has a theology all of it's own... and a majority of it is in direct conflict with the church.

My father was a Scientist... and in spite of having come from a very religous family, only near the very end of his life had be begun to even respect religion from afar. For a majority of his life, he rejected it outright as foolishness and would openly confront others about their beliefs. A majority of his contemporaries seemed to agree with him.

Religion used the "you can't prove it's wrong, so it must be true" argument.
Science is a field dedicated to making conclusions based on concrete evidence ("proof" if you will).

Faith is belief in spite of ~absence~ of proof.

While someone with faith may still believe in things they can see with their own two eyes, someone without it needs something concrete in order to believe.

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aceman67

See, thats one of the things I can't get my head around some peoples staunch belief that Because god created everything, that science has to be wrong.

How do we know that god didn't intend for everything explained in science to be the way he wanted it to be. We don't.

Even the bible says that God works in Mysterious ways.

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atomik_sprout

I know that, but where I lived and where I live now, they only get played on rock stations. Call them what you want, say they're a mixed bunch. They're still rock in the eyes of the ignorant.

And yes, science was made by God. Man can explain things through science, but God can change the laws of science. He did write them after all. And Tsurara, don't get me wrong. Having faith is one thing, believing that this world was created by and is governed by something very unscientific is very different. I don't have faith, because I have no religion. In fact, I say God because I don't know if there's one, two, three, or if God's a woman, man. But I do respect science and I try to figure things out by using logic and fact before I chalk it up to "God".

Science is important. Science has gotten us far and without science, we'd be trying to fly close to the sun with wax wings. But that doesn't mean that we're not being watched and protected.

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Dark.

Was capitalizing "GOD" in the title necessary? The thread was already bound to spark debate.

God may speak in whatever language he chooses. He's all-powerful and all-knowing, he'll speak to you however he damn well pleases. Be it vocal, visual, subconscious, unconscious, ****ed up, drunk, it's his choice. The real question should be when he is talking, will you hear him? It doesn't matter what manner he chooses to speak to you, it's whether or not you'll listen. I don't even know why this is a debate. It's speculation more than anything.

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BrightShadow_96

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Arrianna

Then something told you wrong. Not only is nearly half of polled (2004) scientists religious the numbers are increasing among younger scientists. The question to them isn't whether science exists vs God but "how did God do it". Curiosity is a wonderful thing.

List of Christian thinkers in science

Christians in Science

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Lupas

u guys are great Then something told you wrong. Not only is nearly half of polled (2004) scientists religious the numbers are increasing among younger scientists. The question to them isn't whether science exists vs God but "how did God do it". Curiosity is a wonderful thing.

in my opinion..

The language of god is spread through everything and everyone. The language is an unmistakable echo of nature that is nearly subliminal. As if a secret code that is sent through everything until the message is received. It is a powerful language that requires a deep solemness that is mature and calm. A blow of the wind; howl at the moon; crash of the sea; falling of the rain. Even in the heavens, no words are needed. Instead, a feeling of understanding without effort. Unexplainable. Undetectable. Unreal.

Was capitalizing "GOD" in the title necessary? The thread was already bound to spark debate.

God may speak in whatever language he chooses. He's all-powerful and all-knowing, he'll speak to you however he damn well pleases. Be it vocal, visual, subconscious, unconscious, ****ed up, drunk, it's his choice. The real question should be when he is talking, will you hear him? It doesn't matter what manner he chooses to speak to you, it's whether or not you'll listen. I don't even know why this is a debate. It's speculation more than anything.

arrianna we're not questioning it's existance just the words or code that are used by it (topic!! before aceman yells at u )

brightshadow, i agree, but isn't math spread thoughout the known universe. now a code impressive thinking, are u talking binary?

dark; no it wasn't intentional, but maybe i should be asking myself y i did it . for the most part anyone who hears god's voice is usually insane. why not speak though a mouse or other creature. maybe we're the most insignifigant ones on the planet?

atomic i'll take u up on that offer, but i warn u it's not pretty

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SUFFERING!, YOU HAVEN'T SEEN ANYTHING YET!

tsurara

As you haven't provided a link to the poll of which you're speaking, it's a bit difficult to tell why the numbers worked out how they did, but I'm guessing that the person or organization polling those Scientists were themselves religious if the numbers came out so skewed as to imply that I was "told wrong" and that most scientists are indeed religious.

I grew up around scientists. I have known (and do know) many. And seeing as I have never met one who was actively religious (a handful of agnostics, but no church-goers), I'm guessing that poll is not representative (or was done in the deep south with funding from The 700 Club).

I certainly know no Scientists who are fundimentalists or literally believe the words written in the bible.

I believe that Science and faith are NOT necesarily in conflict. Many Scientists may very well accept the POSSIBILITY of God's existance (as it can't be disproven) or even turn to faith in times of crisis: but very few will defend his existance scientifically or thump bibles. I'm sure there a few... but if they are so numerous, why have I never met one, in spite of having Scientists at the dinner table since I was four...?

I found some stats of my own:
Statistics

Granted, they come from an atheist organization, so they're hardly objective. But even if you don't accept them: they at least show how easy it is to manipulate information to support your cause.

A more well-documented link:
Leading Scientists Still Reject God

And from Wikipedia: " In total, about 60% of scientists in the United States expressed disbelief or doubt in such a god. This compared with 58% in 1914 and 67% in 1933. Among leading scientists defined as members of the National Academy of Sciences, 72.2% expressed disbelief and 93% - disbelief or doubt in the existence of a personal god in 1998." from: Relationship between religion and science - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Even those who express belief in a God (or the possibility of one) are not necesarily religious in the traditional sense. I believe in the possibility of a Judeo-Christian God myself... but I am not Christian. And according to most Christians, I'm still going to hell.

If belief in the "possibility" of a God is not enough to save my soul, why is it enough to support the cause of religion that it is somehow scientifically sound or accepted as compatable?

I, myself, am religious and had quite a few angry confrontations with my father. I don't think myself "unscientific", but I DO find fundimentalism ridiculous and literal interpretation of any scripture impossible.

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