Re: A Literal Killer Whale
I don't think it ate the trainers though...
...if it did, it shoulda' been shot by now. We humans don't tend to forgive anything that sees us as a food source (sharks, mountain lions, bears, dogs, chimpanzees, etc, all killed when they eat any human).
I think it just drowned them (which killer whales and dolphins tend to, mostly unintentionally).
It's a playful action they show... most wild orcas get too playful with other creatures, and humans seem to be the only ones that like to play back (we seem to be the only creatures that interact with them directly without any fear).
If it killed a human in the wild, it's totally okay by me (though others would rather kill it), but this is a trained killer whale. One trained in Sea World, as a Shamu even. When cared for and trained, especially by the experts of Sea World (higher standards than most zoos/parks), ESPECIALLY by Shamu trainers (the best of their best) - the killer whale is trained and taught enough that it should know not to attack humans or play too roughly with them.
...and with other killer whales having been taught by the same trainers and successfully fitting into the stage-life, this one doesn't really have an excuse. It's given responsibility like a growing child.
It's not like it'll be stuck there forever anyways, there have been cases where these killer whales are released into "reservations" (protected waters) or even the wild (mostly a bad idea...) once they reach the age (or receive an severe injury that'll heed its performance) where they should be retired.
Re: A Literal Killer Whale
its the same thing through and through, its a wild animal even in captivatiy which has proven with other animals, when they go with their instintics someone can get hurt.
steve irwin was killed by a sting ray
ummm...i cant think of his name, but they have the big tiger shows in las vegas was attacked by his own white tiger
a woman in colorado who owned a bear was killed by it when she was cleaning out its cage
there have been numerous reports over many years about an animal which is considered wild, that end up attacking someone. Its in their blood, even dogs, and cats can go into that state when their instintics take over. Thats normal for anything that has instincts, even we the humans of great mind capibilties can find the instintcs to kill.
weather it be survival or playfulness that orca did killed its traniner and im quite sure she knew the dangers coming with her job. People now tend to think they can take on anything and tame it to be like a pet, which turns around and bites them in the butt, but this woman knew that she had the chance for being seriously hurt or die in the job, she wouldnt have took it if she hadnt.
dont blame the animals blame the people who think they can control natural instincts
Re: A Literal Killer Whale
People seriously never read other posts...
Originally Posted by clover
Even if it has something to do with an animal's "wild side", that usually has nothing to do with the perception or awareness of the animal. An animal can go "wild" out of frustration, something that we humans do as well. We tend to think "leave the animals alone", but we know they're going to die off if we do (we've screwed up the environment, and reservations can never really be big enough for them to survive permanently without human interference). So some of us want to keep them in captivity, using them for entertainment (in Sea World's case) is to encourage the fascination of animals while still fund several organizations that help save wildlife.
We constantly keep trying to blame the humans here, but it's already obvious: WE ALREADY DID. But we keep seeing the "trapped" animal as a victim.
And why? Because though many of us humans tend to support the protection of animals, we rarely decide to understand them eye-to-eye, brain-to-brain, heart-to-heart. It's hypocritical of us to see them as a wild creature but still claim we know them better than others.
You know who also see them as wild beasts? The ones who are trying to kill them and care less for how they're taken care of or how they survive.
The ones scared for their children, so they go to court to put to sleep a "wild" dog.
The ones who hardly care if an animal species is mistreated, so they continue to refuse to spend a dollar or two in taxes to help them.
You're no better than those people. You're just as blind to animals as the ones who abuse them because you refuse to try to understand them.
Instead of seeing animals as "wild", try seeing it from THEIR POINT OF VIEW.
Dogs, cats, bears, cougars, and (I reluctantly say this) even chimps aren't "wild crazy things that you can't control because it's in their nature".
Look at humans. Look at how we act when we're "not thinking". Look at us when we kill in self-defense, look at us when we hit others when we get frustrated and find no other way to communicate how we feel, look at us when we get angry when someone mocks us or blocks our path, look at us when we fend off strangers when they get too close to our mate - territory - or children: We're just like them and we can understand each other if we JUST TRIED.
Would they still kill us if we understood them? Hell YES they would! Why? Because just like a human: It doesn't matter how much you understand them, if you piss them off, cross their line, or ignore their warnings - THEY'LL STILL KILL YOU.
Of course, we humans seem to care about "laws" that we invented. Animals could care less since they follow their own speechless rules that they think WE ARE intruding on (and we are). So while we wouldn't immediately kill each other, they easily would, because nothing stops them from doing so.
We humans can't control animals just like we can't control other humans. We often try to control our children, and unless we reach a compromise, finally understand what they're feelings and nurture it accordingly, or break them: They'll never truly do what we want them to do. We also can't control convicts or ignorant people... heck, we can't control anyone. We can only inspire them to. THEY would have to want to do as we say, no other reason. The same goes for animals.
Think about it, think about those who actually truly care for these animals --- WHY do they usually let them go at a certain age? That's right: Sexual Maturity!
When animals get to certain age, they get territorial, they get frustrated, they get like what their species get like at that age. And we humans do the same. We get frustrated, we get rebellious, we get irrational, we think we know better than those who raised us.
Why? Because it's in our genes, we put it in there through generations of growing up. The change between child and adult in almost all species is pretty darn dramatic, that the transition is "violent".
But some of us humans block these reactions out through logic and thinking. Abstract thoughts.
Can animals do the same? Animals HAVE done the same. Animals fight off their "instincts" whenever they really appreciate their "owners"/partners/parents. Animals have refused to kill other animals when they found pity in them. Animals have refused to go back to the wild because they'd rather be with their human family.
What does this show? It shows that instincts is a buncha' crock for an excuse!
Several other Killer Whales from Sea World have passed their lifetime with a great record of good behavioral patterns, many went to retirement after their days in the spotlight were done.
Why not this one? Why not blame this one?
We humans will blame an innocent for "snapping" when mistreated. Do you know why? Because other innocents have taken the same mistreatment and lived on to forgive and forget.
Yes, it's other people's faults that this innocent snapped, but if others have passed -then we should blame this one for not caring enough to stay calm and cool!
So no, instincts is a poor excuse. Especially when many others from the same area, treatment, and species rarely have shown the same form of aggressiveness and gotten away with it.
And lastly: Like I said before -- just because a guard of a prison knows what he's getting himself into, doesn't mean that when he dies by the hands of an innocent who's frustrated at his imprisonment - it's okay. The killer gets more years of imprisonment, moved to another section, or the death sentence. This should be no different.
Re: A Literal Killer Whale
all good points. Though i still stick with what i had written, because thats the way i see alot of it. While i dont go through all the posts due to terrible adhd, and usually when im on here, im at work so i also dont have time to read all the posts. i also did not read all of your last post, i skimmed it to get a basic concept of you telling me that im wrong, not very smart, and giving me a lesson is pyshcology.
I do believe i dont have to read all the other posts either, as long as im writting on the topic of this thread and not sidetracking i can still write here my veiw and opnions of the topic.
though i did point out that humans also have those pesky natural instintcs, its a part of what makes us all living beings. without them, how would we know how to survive, and protect ourselves? Its apart of the awareness of all animals and how they act, like we ourselves do on a daily basis. Its something that teaches us all from the begining how to live, and survive along with the awarness of whats around us, to using our minds to figure out the how, and why of it for ourselves and to our advantage.
while i mostly do blame humanity for the corrupting most wildlife, i understand the need to. Its for studying them, as well as creating an interest to help keep them alive from what some people are killing them for, which is money on the black market, or their own personal needs.
though if for one second you think im judging what one of any species does, that makes me more attired to " one did this so their all bad" scenerio then really you dont know me.
I have always forgivin many for the actions of some people or animals. Ive saved pitbulls from being put down because their considered dangerous for something thats not their faults but that of their owners, or the owners of that dangerous dog. growing up on a farm surrounded by animals has taught me the just because theirs one bad seed, doesnt condemn the others of the litter.
Ive seen good bulls, horses, roosters, pigs, goats, dogs, cats, geese even be put down because they get into this blind rage of instintcs for no reason what so ever, to people just putting them into that state. Even cogurs, mountain lions, possum, deer, and shark, use their instintcs to stay alive, or protect themselves.
Ive seen wild animals be broken because of their natural instintcs and become lifeless, while one who was raised by humans do something bad, and having to die for it.
all play a scenerio thats alike in mob mentality
ive seen chimps around their meat eating season which is not pretty in any way. once the one chimp spots the pray it chases it down only the one event hough their all in that state, when he catches the pray though they all go insane and tear into it to get their share of the meat.
ive also seen the same thing happen in a crowd of people when one person throws the first punch, everyone if not most of the people start throwing punches and fighting
same thing different actions, its because of that instinct that people and animals go into the mob mentality. Some can control that though, no problem, not every chimp in the area is going to be like only the ones involved in that group, like every person in the area in that huge fight is going to pick that up and start a city wide fight. Though alike in many ways, theres some in those groups that can control that instinct and avoid it.
ive listed all those people and incidents because those are cases where the animal has gone into that single point of losing the awarness and the natural instincts take over, steve irwin knew the risks he was taking and took it gladly to understand and teach others about those wild animals. I dont think he would want the sting ray dead for something that was natural for it to protect itself. Or the owners of those other animals because they have shown love to them over the time they were connected.
There are things you can never control, be it instincts, or something that natural to any animal thats something you can never fully remove. I still blame people because they think that they can control that instinct of animal, or tame it. All people know the risks that they take when they take on any animal, because even tamed and hand risen they can go into the tunnel and loose they awarness around them and strike at anything that is in their way weather they mean it or not.
for me why should the orca die for killing someone that loved it dearly. while in our own society a person who kills someone who loved them dearly from one thing or another lives and spends their life in prison, or on poroll plotting their next vitim? im not talking about all of them, but the ones you know u should be worried about. what makes these repeat offenders in our own society be able to live out their lives in prison, while this orca should be killed for something that most likley comes naturally to it? why should it be killed when we dont kill our own killers.
on the off hand i dont think the whale should be killed for something that comes naturally to it weather it be from protecting itself from something, or it being playful and killing her in the end. She knew there were risks when she took on her job, and she gladly took them to help others understand and take an interest in the orca which she most likley dearly loved.
Re: A Literal Killer Whale
i hope they dont kill the whale. I think the news report said that the whale was known to be aggressive they should have taken it out of the show a long time ago IMO.